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| sickofpalantirs |
 Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:38 pm |
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 7750
Location: somwhere, over the rainbow way up high. There's a land that I heard of once in a lullaby.
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in france there are also huge riots  though that is off-topic and really has nothing to do with the current situation.
no clue whether this is trustworthy look at it
nother thing
course then you have this |
Last edited by sickofpalantirs on Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:45 pm; edited 1 time in total Sop's haves/ top wants
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| macheteman |
| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:43 pm |
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Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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Location: The Jungle
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no offence taken, and none meant, but i disagree. you also have to take into consideration that america has tons of people, which has an effect on the # of murders. and also think about the type of government. there are socialist governments who’s countries have very few murders, largely due to the fact that the wealth is distributed to the people, in such a way as to reduce poverty. in America we have capitalism, it gives eaqual opportunity, but the citizens who work hard, and well, will recieve more wealth, and the citizens who don’t will be poor. greater poverty has a negative impact on crime. america does have a lot of murders, but i would never trade capitalism for anything. plus, guns are an american citizen’s protection in case the american government becomes oppressive. freedom isn’t free. americans have a lot of freedom, but there is a price. but it’s a price that i’m willing to pay, because freedom is one of the greatest things it this world.
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| Celebrimbor |
| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:55 pm |
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Joined: 12 Sep 2006
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Location: UNKNOWN
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Of course the # of people who have guns will effect the # of murderers. Well, Most murderers have guns. 
It is not the gun that does the violence, but the person behind it. So the answer is not gun control. |
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| gil-estel |
| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 2:33 pm |
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
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Location: Groningen, the Netherlands
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Does capitalism realy provide equal opportunities? It is a system, that doesn’t take in consideration the difference in capacities. I myself also treasure freedom, but indeed, at what cost? Freedom can be achieved in many ways. And capitalism seems to serve one purpose, the best interest of yourself. That kind of self interest is more likely to create distance between people than the amount of money. As I read the bible -as often as I can- Jesus warned us for these things: Evil will spread and cause many people to stop loving others.Mathew 24:13. And this lack of love, because we’re so wrapped up serving our own interest, makes people desperate and totaly unaware of things they do. This is a problem of the entire Western world. And if you provide people with guns they can do stupid things. In Holland we say: a cat that is cornered, makes unexpected jumps.
So true, you need a person to pull the trigger, but with guns hard to get, less people will pull it. Instead of spending soooo much money on weapons, more money could be spend in social projects for those who once failed and try to make a living of their own. Maybe there are equal possibilities, but some need a little bit of help. Don’t write of certain people who for some reason seem to struggle down their road.
We can wait for the Lord to do this: He will settle arguments between nations. They will pound their swords and their spears into rakes and shovels; they will never make war or attack one another. Isiah 2:4, but we could already make a start! |
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| AgentDrake |
| Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:15 pm |
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Joined: 01 Apr 2007
Posts: 667
Location: Halfway between eccentric and insane...
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A few random comments on things that jumped out at me here:
gil-estel wrote: We can wait for the Lord to do this: He will settle arguments between nations. They will pound their swords and their spears into rakes and shovels; they will never make war or attack one another. Isiah 2:4, but we could already make a start!
"A time for War, and a time for Peace. "(Somewhere in Ecclesiates; I don’t remember where.)
"The world will always be a battlefield" (Lancelot, in King Arthur [as in, the movie] Okay, so it’s not from the Bible, but I think it’s still valid...)
The very idea of trying to solve -- or even reduce -- violence and/or murder by removing guns is absolutely absurd for this reason:
Even if you were to eliminate guns from the equation entirely, and not even the bad guys have them, you just devolve the technology level by one step. (Or evolve it, hich is theoretically possible if they get something more advanced than guns, but that doesn’t seem likely.) The killers will still be killers. Changing their choice of weapons is not going to make them lose their intentions of killing (or threatening, injuring, et cetera.) So now an equal number of killings occur, except by crossbow, blunderbuss, sword, knife, dagger, rope, chain, et cetera and whatever. Heck, you could kill someone with a coffee cup if you really want to.
Like gil-estel pointed out, "With great power comes great responsibility." That doesn’t make the power bad. It just makes the abuser of said power bad.
A bow and arrow is theoretically just as bad as a gun, as it is just as deadly.
Edit: is the text in the quote box above really, really tiny for everyone else, too? I can’t get it to be a normal size.  |
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| macheteman |
| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:25 am |
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Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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Location: The Jungle
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gil-estel wrote: Does capitalism realy provide equal opportunities?
theoreticly, but not in actuality.
gil-estel wrote: As I read the bible -as often as I can- Jesus warned us for these things: Evil will spread and cause many people to stop loving others.Mathew 24:13.
this is not Mt. 24:13. this is Mt. 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
gil-estel wrote: And if you provide people with guns they can do stupid things. So true, you need a person to pull the trigger, but with guns hard to get, less people will pull it.
people can do stupid things without guns. and as a christian, i firmly believe that it is sin nature that makes people kill, not guns. Cain killed Able long before guns. just because guns are harder to get does not mean less people will be hurt. you can kill with your bare hands, and peoiple will find a way to kill no matter what, because of sin.
-macheteman |
Check out my best article The Utterly Corrupt Corruption,
If at first you don't succeed...Sky-diving isn't for you.
"Combat is dangerous. It tends to interupt your breathing process."
ROLF!!! |
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| fingolfin |
| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:31 am |
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Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 321
Location: it's getting hotter in Iowa every day
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I thought this was a gun topic?
I only have a wimpy .22 bolt action rifle.  |
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| macheteman |
| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:56 am |
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Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 1200
Location: The Jungle
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| dude, .22’s are awesome. quiet, fun, and cheap. |
Check out my best article The Utterly Corrupt Corruption,
If at first you don't succeed...Sky-diving isn't for you.
"Combat is dangerous. It tends to interupt your breathing process."
ROLF!!! |
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| Celebrimbor |
| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:08 pm |
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Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 953
Location: UNKNOWN
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| Yeah!! I love my rifle. |
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Popcorn is not gooey like fat, and also not crunchy like potato chips, but crispy like lettuce which makes it a healthy snack. |
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| gil-estel |
| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:39 pm |
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Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Posts: 545
Location: Groningen, the Netherlands
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"A time for War, and a time for Peace. "(Somewhere in Ecclesiates; I don’t remember where.)
So we shouldn’t make an effort to make it a time of peace?
The very idea of trying to solve -- or even reduce -- violence and/or murder by removing guns is absolutely absurd for this reason:
Even if you were to eliminate guns from the equation entirely, and not even the bad guys have them, you just devolve the technology level by one step. (Or evolve it, hich is theoretically possible if they get something more advanced than guns, but that doesn’t seem likely.) The killers will still be killers.
Not true, because you’re not born as a killer, you become one when you first killed somebody. And when it’s made that easy, as you can obtain a weapon very easily, you are likely to kill earlier. It’s true you can kill with anything else, but you must agree that a gun is designed for one reason: to hurt/kill another person. Most of the kills aren’t carefully planned, people react in a outbreak of emotions. They grap the best thing they can put their hands on: a gun. Many uncertain people carry a gun to feel save. That means they wander around being nervous, because if you weren’t, you wouldn’t carry one. In a split-second they face a situation. Not reacting out of good sence, but in emotion, they shoot to kill. Without guns you would see a drastic decrease of casualties. I can show you an Austrian study concerning this subject....but he, I;m not here to convert people, I just try make my point....
Like gil-estel pointed out, "With great power comes great responsibility." That doesn’t make the power bad. It just makes the abuser of said power bad.
And in the past -let’s say- 6000 years, we proved unable to deal with great responsibility....unfortunatly..So please don’t increase the responsibility.... |
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