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| corvus |
 Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:48 am |
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 1696
Location: Roaming, but dangerous!!!
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| Well dear, AP i haven’t seen an actual communistic form of goverment (i trhink the Cuban system is a dictatorship) so i cannot compare them. |
Click here if you want to trade some foils away 
Far, Far beyond the island we dwelt in shapes of twilight
Through draught and weary days
Through grief and endless pain |
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| sickofpalantirs |
| Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:35 pm |
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 7750
Location: somwhere, over the rainbow way up high. There's a land that I heard of once in a lullaby.
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| The USSR was communist and dissolved. The USA was capitalist and is still around. That works for me |
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"DáinIronfoot"
Spammers really are amazing creatures. You can learn all there is to know about their ways in a month. And yet, after a hundred years, they can still surprise you.  |
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| NBarden |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:33 pm |
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Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 5468
Location: I don't know...
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Shieldmaiden wrote: Please do not take the following as an attack. I do not wish to be attacked, so please refrain. I am not backing any religion, nor am I saying that any religion is wrong. I, myself, believe in God, but I do not believe in any religion in particular. And I believe that everyone has a right to their own beliefs (as long as they don’t try to force their beliefs onto me).
I only want to say, for the record, that the Bible is chock full of contradictions, these being but a very few:
Lying
Exodus 20:16 "Thou shalt not bear false witness."
Proverbs 12:22 "Lying lips are an abomination to the Lord."
-in contrast to-
I Kings 22:23 "The Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee."
II Thessalonians 2:11 "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie."
Killing
Exodus 20:13 "Thou shalt not kill."
Leviticus 24:17 "And he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death."
-in contrast to-
I Samuel 15:2,3,7,8 "Thus saith the Lord . . . Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. . . . And Saul smote the Amalekites . . . and utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword."
Numbers 15:36 "And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses."
Hosea 13:16 "they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with children shall be ripped up."
Stealing
Exodus 20:15 "Thou shalt not steal."
Leviticus 19:13 "Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbor, neither rob him."
-in contrast to-
Exodus 3:22 "And ye shall spoil the Egyptians."
Luke 19:29-34 "[Jesus] sent two of his disciples, Saying, Go ye into the village . . . ye shall find a colt tied, whereon yet never man sat: loose him, and bring him hither. And if any man ask you, Why do ye loose him? thus shall ye say unto him, Because the Lord hath need of him. . . . And as they were loosing the colt, the owners thereof said unto them, Why loose ye the colt? And they said, The Lord hath need of him."
Graven Images
Leviticus 26:1 "Ye shall make ye no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone."
Deuteronomy 27:15 "Cursed be the man that maketh any graven or molten image."
-in contrast to-
Exodus 25:18 "And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them."
I Kings 7:15,16,23,25 "For he [Solomon] cast two pillars of brass . . . and two chapiters of molten brass . . . And he made a molten sea . . . it stood upon twelve oxen . . . [and so on]"
God Changes His Mind
Numbers 23:19 "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent."
-in contrast to-
Exodus 32:14 "And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people."
Punishment For Parental Sins
Exodus 20:5 "For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation." (Repeated in Deuteronomy 5:9)
-in contrast to-
Ezekiel 18:20 "The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father."
Deuteronomy 24:16 "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."
I could go on for days, but there is simply far too much to post here. As I said, I’m not saying that Christianity (or any other religion) is wrong, simply saying that there are many Biblical contradictions.
Okay, their forums are back up and I posted this.
First of all, I’d like to ask whether you examined the context of these verses. Context has a lot to do with analyzing Scripture.
Scripture also has two sets of laws, one for within a civilization, and another law for wartime. A lot of these contradictions are really not contradictions at all. For example, thou shalt not kill is a law for operating within a society. However, in wartime, obviously this law can’t be followed. Other laws, such as thou shall not steal, are also different during wartime. The laws given by God in Scripture refer to running a nation, with different laws dealing with other nations during war.
Now, about the contradictions.
First, let’s look at lying. In King’s, examine the context.
And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade [him], and prevail also: go forth, and do so.
Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.
Looking at the context, God here is allowing a spirit to lie. What spirit this is, the Bible doesn’t say. But this is hardly a contradiction. Also, with Thessalonians, this says absolutely nothing about lying being OK, it says that God will send delusions among them. Doesn’t say lying is okay, but God sometimes uses evil to work against itself.
On killing, Scripture differentiates between murder, execution, and wartime killing.
On stealing, see wartime comment. On Jesus taking a donkey, the disciples let the owners know what they were doing and the owners let them use the donkey. Last time I checked, that’s not stealing.
On idols, what its referring to is making idols that people worship. The cherubim are NOT idols, they were decorative. Same with the pillars and the oxen and the seas of brass.
On God changing his mind, nothing says that he can’t change his mind. He’s God. Also, some versions of the Bible phrase things differently. Take a look at a different version than the one you cited.
Exodus 32:14 "Then the LORD relented and did not bring on his people the disaster he had threatened."
OR
"So the LORD changed His mind about the harm which He said He would do to His people."
Supposed contradiction gone.
On parental sins, simple distinction between God descendants vs man judging descendants.
If you have any more contradictions to bring up, I’m happy to address them. |
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As I lay in bed staring at the stars last night, I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"
Spotlight on....Sense of Obligation. |
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| sickofpalantirs |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:22 pm |
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 7750
Location: somwhere, over the rainbow way up high. There's a land that I heard of once in a lullaby.
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 Well said Nb  |
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(mm)"SoP: you will always be the Official CC Spammer in my heart"
"DáinIronfoot"
Spammers really are amazing creatures. You can learn all there is to know about their ways in a month. And yet, after a hundred years, they can still surprise you. |
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| bobtheorc |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:09 pm |
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Joined: 19 Mar 2006
Posts: 1218
Location: Wow, its hot in Iowa
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| man_flesh |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:29 pm |
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Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 18
Location: MA
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Ok NB. First off lets quit bible thumping. That proves nothing here. Also, as for the quotes, they are typical conservative tactics. The old classic "if, then" logical falicy. "If so and so said this then this and this must be true also." Sorry, they don’t work and prove nothing. The first amendment is there in black and white and there is nothing you can say to discredit it. The founders had experience with an official state religion as they were British subjects. (The Anglican Church) They wanted to ensure that we had the freedom to choose how and when we worshiped. As a Christian, I hold this right and liberty close to my heart. Just because Christians are in thee majority in America and Just because the country was founded by Christians does not mean that Christianity is the state religion!!! Don’t agree? Read the first amendment again. Freedom is what makes America great. This is not a theocracy.
PS Christian Democrats do exist. You can be religious and think for yourself. |
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| NBarden |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:21 pm |
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Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 5468
Location: I don't know...
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When someone raises an attack on my religion, its only natural to defend it.
Christianity is not the state religion. This doesn’t mean that Christians cannot hold office, cannot make their views known in office, and cannot base their decisions on a Christian worldview. It just means that they can’t force everyone to become Christians, not that Christianity is supposed to be completely separate from government.
As for Christian democrats, I know they exist. Look at Zel Miller. I have some Christian friends who are democrat. However, on the whole, things that the Democratic party advocates, such as abortion, gay marriage, and other social issues are core reasons why I’m a republican. Economic issues are a side point, although I tend to lean Republican on those as well. As said, Christianity doesn’t really tell you what to think on economic issues.
However, the social issues are enough for me to go Republican. |
-Trade With Me
Add the popcorn smiley to your sig, help it achieve world domination.
What if the hokey pokey really IS what its all about?
As I lay in bed staring at the stars last night, I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"
Spotlight on....Sense of Obligation. |
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| hawkeyespf |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:25 pm |
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Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 198
Location: Round Lake IL
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| NBarden |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:28 pm |
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Joined: 28 Dec 2006
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The Muslim worldview says kill all Christians and Jews. Its an inherently violent religion. I challenge you to find anything like that in a Christian worldview.
Also, this nation was founded upon Christianity. Since you asked me not to bring up any more quotes, I take it that that’s a given. If not, I have more quotes. So its natural that a Christian worldview would permeate government.
And no, I wouldn’t be comfortable. You probably wouldn’t be comfortable with a Christian president. However, it is their right and we couldn’t stop it, if they were legally elected. |
-Trade With Me
Add the popcorn smiley to your sig, help it achieve world domination.
What if the hokey pokey really IS what its all about?
As I lay in bed staring at the stars last night, I thought to myself, "where the heck is the ceiling?"
Spotlight on....Sense of Obligation. |
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| sickofpalantirs |
| Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:53 pm |
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 7750
Location: somwhere, over the rainbow way up high. There's a land that I heard of once in a lullaby.
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| I would certainly not be comfortable with a muslim president. |
Sop's haves/ top wants
(mm)"SoP: you will always be the Official CC Spammer in my heart"
"DáinIronfoot"
Spammers really are amazing creatures. You can learn all there is to know about their ways in a month. And yet, after a hundred years, they can still surprise you. |
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