Wither and Deathtouch

[TheJord]

If my crit attacks and deals damage, and has both these keywords, and the crit blocking has persist... do they get to persist?

[FM]

When they deal combat damage, deathtouch triggers and is put on the stack. Then, since players WOULD get priority, SBE's are checked, and see a creature with 0 toughness and put it into it's owner's graveyard. Since it had -1/-1 counters on it, it won't persist. Then, deathtough will resolve, doing nothing since the creature is no longer in play.

[SomeRandomDude]

I think he was maybe thinking of a scenario where, say, Kitchen Finks are boosted by a pair of lieges and run into a 2/2 deathtouch wither. But yeah, deathtouch, by definition, occurs after combat damage, meaning the creatures has the counters and is then put into the graveyard, no persist.

I had a question. Can Quillspike, hypothetically, disrupt this?

[FM]

Nope. Counters from wither are placed AS damage is dealt (it's a different way to do damage, but it's not triggered or anything). As so, if a creature ends up with 0 toughness, SBE's are checked BEFORE any player would receive priority, so the 0-toughness creature will be put into its owner graveyard as a State-Based Effect before you have priority to activate Quillspike's ability.

[SomeRandomDude]

But...I think you're missing the point. This has nothing to do with 0 toughness at all.

The combo that he's looking at is when deathtouch kills the creature, not damage.

My question was also relating to that. Under this hypothesis. Kitchen Finks is facing a 1/1 wither deathtouch. The 1/1 wither deathtouch hits it for 1 damage, reducing the 3/2 Finks to 2/1. It is then destroyed by deathtouch, not by toughness being reduced to 0. As for that, the creature doesn't persist, Jordy, because the damage step is before the end of combat step.

My question is this. Could I hypothetically use Quillspike between the time damage resolves and Kitchen Finks takes damage to REMOVE the counter, so when deathtouch goes off, it persists?

[FM]

If the counter itself does not kill the creature, yes, you can. When damage is dealt, counters are placed. Then, since damage was dealt, deathtouch wull trigger (it's a triggered ability), and will go onto the stack. Because of this, players will receive priority, so when you have priority, you CAN use Quillspike's activated ability and remove that counter.
I missed the "boosted by a pair of Lieges" bit, which is why I answered the question with the Finks having 0 toughness. Sorry. Anyway, this way you get the answers to both scenarios!