Another Terrible As the Dawn Question

[rubbercarp]

I read "The Free Peoples player may discard 2 Elves to prevent this. " as: The cost to prevent 3 wounds to Galadriel is to discard 2 elves.

If Stewards Tomb says you can't prevent wounds then you can't prevent the 3 wounds from Terrible as the Dawn.

However, I am often wrong when it comes to rulings =)

[Alazzar]

I really think the argument could go either way, but I'll just go ahead and play devil's advocate regarding Elessar's post, because I like doing that, and NO ONE CAN STOP ME!

(Well, except a moderator.  But that's not the point!)

Anyway, the example quoted from the rulebook isn't really related to our scenario here.  The rulebook is saying,  "If an effect asks you to do A or B, and you choose A but then prevent it, you now have to do B."  In more exact terms, it's saying, "If you choose to wound the Ring-bearer (A) instead of adding threats [B) from the Morgul Destroyer, and then you prevent the wound to the Ring-bearer (A), you now have to add threats [B)."  Essentially, it's pointing out that one of those two things HAS to happen.

So what happened was this:

1.  Choose A or B
2.  Select A.
3.  (Optional):  Prevent A
4.  If you prevented A, you must now do B.

With our TATD scenario, we're saying, "When given a choice between discarding Elves (A) and wounding Galadriel [B), we choose to discard Elves (A)."

Meaning we did this:

1.  Choose A or B.
2.  Select A, discarding your elves.

Since we have no way of preventing our elves from being discarded after we've committed to that, the scenario ends here.  As you can see, the Morgul Destroyer scenario in the rulebook is trying to cover an entirely different problem.

Basically, I'm not doing anything to prove either point with this post, I'm just saying that I don't think that the Morgul Destroyer excerpt from the rulebook applies here.  =P

EDIT:  Had to change to [B), because ( B ) was turning into a skull.  =P

[Kralik]

I know that you're playing Devil's Advocate, but I think you missed ES's point. Aside from the specific example, he was noting that the "this" is shorthand for the entire phrase "prevent the threats from being added." Similarly, Terrible as the Dawn could read:

Manuever: Spot a minion to wound Galadriel 3 times. The Free Peoples player may discard 2 Elves to prevent these wounds.

[Alazzar]

Ok, gotcha... I knew as I was writing that that there must have been something I missed.  I was like, "These scenarios are completely different... wtf?"

Thanks for clearin' that up, Kralik.  =P

[Elessar's Socks]

Thanks, Kralik, that's what I was driving at (well, my view of it anyway!).

[Ulfmane]

in my opinion RGStag is right...

And I think in this situation, if the FP player does not even get the option to prevent a SINGLE card to make him lose the entire game, that cards is overpowered and make Galadriel as RB auto lose vs decks including TATD... why not just announcing at the beginning of the game "oh, I use TATD, dont u lose ur time and just concede"... cmon....

on the other hand, TADT is useless vs any other FP and takes u 1 or 2 slots in deckbuilding....

still, think FP should have the option

[ket_the_jet]

Answer To All Riddles. Nenya. There are ways to survive one deck spot.
-wtk

[Elessar's Socks]

Also The Ring of Rings, which converts (for lack of a better game term) instead of prevents.

[ket_the_jet]

The One Ring, Isildur's Bane. The One Ring, the Ruling Ring as well.
-wtk

[Alazzar]

The Ruling Ring only converts wounds in a skirmish; Terrible as the Dawn is a maneuver event.

[ket_the_jet]

The Ruling Ring only converts wounds in a skirmish; Terrible as the Dawn is a maneuver event.

Good call. Haven't used that Ring in years!
-wtk

[Alazzar]

I used it recently because I played a few games in a no-rare format.  It was kinda weird usin' that ring.  Isildur's Bane was one of the first cards I ever traded for, and I've never had a need to use the Ruling Ring while owning any version of a rare ring.  =P

[Kralik]

The Ruling Ring still has its perks... such as... errmmm.... well...

It's kinda good vs. Twilight Nazgul. Sure, Isildur's Bane gives you extra vitality (important!), but the Ruling Ring won't pile up as many burdens!

I still wish the Ring of Rings was Movie-block. My favorite.