Flaw in Star Wars Plot (Episodes 4, 5, and 6 only)

[Kev-La]

Hmmm .... not sure about this. Gas giants have no solid surface - they are gas. I am pretty sure I saw the rebels on solid ground so Yavin 4 must be a terrestrial planet.

Yavin 4 is a moon orbiting the gas giant Yavin. The Death Star has to orbit the planet before it can get a clear shot at the moon upon which the rebels have their base. See http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yavin 4.

[chompers]

Hmmm .... not sure about this. Gas giants have no solid surface - they are gas. I am pretty sure I saw the rebels on solid ground so Yavin 4 must be a terrestrial planet.

Yavin 4 is a moon orbiting the gas giant Yavin. The Death Star has to orbit the planet before it can get a clear shot at the moon upon which the rebels have their base. See http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Yavin 4.

Well there you go ... now it makes sense where this topic is going.

[Kev-La]

3) The opening crawl of Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope reads as follows:

Episode IV
A NEW HOPE 
It is a period of civil war.
Rebel spaceships, striking
from a hidden base, have won
their first victory against
the evil Galactic Empire.

During the battle, Rebel
spies managed to steal secret
plans to the Empire's
ultimate weapon, the DEATH
STAR, an armored space
station with enough power
to destroy an entire planet.

Pursued by the Empire's
sinister agents, Princess
Leia races home aboard her
starship, custodian of the
stolen plans that can save her
people and restore
freedom to the galaxy....

(NB: The underline is mine).

See, but the opening credits just refer to the Empire as sinister.

The opening crawl refers to the Empire as evil and its agents as sinister.

[ket_the_jet]

The opening crawl refers to the Empire as evil and its agents as sinister.

I am still unconvinced that the opening crawl wasn't made by a terrorist sympathizer.
-wtk

[Pepi]

I've been searching through the forum, just as an every decent young member would, and I ran into a topic called Getting to know you....
Out of sheere curiosity I checked it out, and I learned some horrific facts about ket_the_jet:
- an American
- working(or will possibly be working) in the government
- thinks that Galactic Empire is a good way of governing people

There's nothing wrong with any of these facts separately(except maybe for the last one, but we're still debating it, obviously), but all three combined make one #$&*@! of a deadly combo. xD

[ket_the_jet]

You sure went a long way back. I just updated that since you referenced the post and I am indeed employed.
-wtk

[Kev-La]

I am still unconvinced that the opening crawl wasn't made by a terrorist sympathizer.
-wtk

*Smirk*

[Gate Troll]

I'm slightly disappointed with this topic. I figured it would be about the massive gaping hole at the end of Episode 6, not an attempt to justify the Empire's killing of billions of people and to paint the Rebellion as a terrorist group. I imagine your next topic will be about how frigging retarded the American Revolution was, after all, George III wasn't even a mass-murderer. As for the far more obvious plot hole: How the #$&*@! would an Empire that had been established for nearly two decades fall completely because of the loss of a leader and a few wonder weapons? Imagine a story about National Socialist Germany where the Germans are defeated because Hitler happens to be killed on some huge battleship out in the middle of the ocean. The whole Third Reich just crumbles to pieces right there. The Empire might eventually collapse like the Soviet Union, but that doesn't mean that the Empire, an institution that had managed to keep thousands of worlds in compliance for around 20 years would just up and surrender to a motley group of heros. Not #$&*@! likely.

[legolas3333]

Ok, hitler was a bad example because his generals wanted peace and he knew it, that's why he had many of them killed, there were more than 100 attempts on his life from 1939 to 1945 and he was holding the Nazi regime together

[Kev-La]

I know this thread is a discussion regarding Episodes IV, V and VI only, but I feel I should point out that in the Expanded Universe, the Empire is not destroyed at the Battle of Endor. It is, however, a very important victory for the rebels and is certainly worthy of celebration by them.

[MR. Lurtzy]

The key point here is that you cannot only use these 3 movies when trying to convince us of plotholes.

[Kev-La]

The key point here is that you cannot only use these 3 movies when trying to convince us of plotholes.

I agree. Besides, the Empire being presented as "evil" is not what I would regard as a plothole of any sort; more like an arguably justifiable authorial decision.

[Pepi]

The key point here is that you cannot only use these 3 movies when trying to convince us of plotholes.

Yes! SW is such a huge universe...It's even growing as we speak with all the cartoons and stuff, they're making. Like it, or not...The original trilogy currently represents just a small fraction of the whole saga.

[Elessar's Socks]

About them plot holes, I'm still not convinced an attack on the exhaust port from above would've been all that more suicidal than a trench run. Those proton torpedoes made crazy 90-degree turns on a dime to enter the shaft, so it seems like other approach vectors would've been possible as well.

Also, why didn't Rebels or Imperials alike try to shoot down enemy craft in the trench from above? Good ol' Han didn't play by the rules.

If the Empire brought galactic stability, is the sacrifice of one planet of agent provocateurs a big loss? At what point do the ends justify the means?
-wtk

I don't really have an answer for the "ends justify the means" part, but it seems that when the numbers game is played, it's easy to stop seeing the forest for the trees. Wherever that line is drawn, an empire that would execute a couple billion people as a demonstration of force, in line with their policy of fear, doesn't sound like a "good" empire to me. Also... who would give their ships names like Accuser, Executor, and Tyrant?

While galactic stability should save lives, I'm also looking at the methods used to reach and maintain it. To use a real-world example, North Korea seems relatively stable to me, but I definitely wouldn't want to live there.

P.S. EU aside, those Ewoks were wiped out for sure.

[ket_the_jet]

...who would give their ships names like Accuser, Executor, and Tyrant?

Are these crafts named in the film? Or is this additional information brought in from somewhere else?
-wtk